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	<title>Comments on: Steve Jones: Academia&#8217;s Oliver Stone (and that&#8217;s not good)</title>
	<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/</link>
	<description>Independent thinking about  California Politics, Hot Bikini Clad Teachers (Erica Chevillar), Topless Teachers (Tamara Hoover), Hot French Newscaster Melissa Theuriau, Katie Rees  &#038; the LA Times</description>
	<pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2008 06:44:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: StumbleUpon</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-47281</link>
		<author>StumbleUpon</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Feb 2007 04:05:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-47281</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-ref-pre%--&gt;[...] nction sf(){document.f.url.focus();}   	   	     Your page is now on StumbleUpon!      For each appearance in your referral logs, one of our [...]&lt;!--%kramer-ref-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[&#8230;] nction sf(){document.f.url.focus();}   	   	     Your page is now on StumbleUpon!      For each appearance in your referral logs, one of our [&#8230;]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: AOL Message Boards -- Conspiracy Film Rewrites Sept. 11 -- Re: EXCELLENT MOVIES FOR THOSE WITH OPEN MIND..CHECK IT OUT</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-11854</link>
		<author>AOL Message Boards -- Conspiracy Film Rewrites Sept. 11 -- Re: EXCELLENT MOVIES FOR THOSE WITH OPEN MIND..CHECK IT OUT</author>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 May 2006 15:04:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-11854</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-ref-pre%--&gt;[...] s: Academia’s Oliver Stone (and that’s not good) [...]&lt;!--%kramer-ref-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[&#8230;] s: Academia’s Oliver Stone (and that’s not good) [&#8230;]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: Independent Sources  &#187; Blog Archive   &#187; Charlie Sheen Says 9/11 is a fraud so it must be so</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-9730</link>
		<author>Independent Sources  &#187; Blog Archive   &#187; Charlie Sheen Says 9/11 is a fraud so it must be so</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Mar 2006 05:19:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-9730</guid>
		<description>[...] whole cadre of otherwise unknowns trying to eek out some fame with their lunatic theories. Steve Jones (not the Sex Pistol) is leading the pack. 	Sheen is correct in one thing only.  [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] whole cadre of otherwise unknowns trying to eek out some fame with their lunatic theories. Steve Jones (not the Sex Pistol) is leading the pack. 	Sheen is correct in one thing only.  [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Ministry of Truth</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5303</link>
		<author>Ministry of Truth</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Nov 2005 08:05:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5303</guid>
		<description>Insider, u're avoiding my question, I'm not interested in little green men, tho is the kind of topic that interests u a lot, it seems...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Insider, u&#8217;re avoiding my question, I&#8217;m not interested in little green men, tho is the kind of topic that interests u a lot, it seems&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Insider</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5291</link>
		<author>Insider</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Nov 2005 00:42:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5291</guid>
		<description>Let's talk about little green men walking among us. Let's talk about crop circles. Let's talk about the Apollo missions being faked on a Hollywood soundstage. I love a whacky conspiracy theory as much as anyone (especially when it is as well thought out and documented as you have done it on your site) but come on, do you really, really think you are on to something?

Question: were the London/Madrid bombings part of this too? Is Barbara Boxer in on it? You know that she's owns Haliburton stock. How about the Jews? I heard that they were all cleared out of the towers right before the planes hit? Did Cheney call the Isralis who warned their people? I guess we can't trust them to keep a secret.

You guys must love the "Da Vinci Code" and I have to admit I liked it to. The difference is that I see it as fiction. You no doubt see it as "food for thought."

Regardless, thanks for keeping the world from being a boring place. Now where is my aluminum foil hat?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let&#8217;s talk about little green men walking among us. Let&#8217;s talk about crop circles. Let&#8217;s talk about the Apollo missions being faked on a Hollywood soundstage. I love a whacky conspiracy theory as much as anyone (especially when it is as well thought out and documented as you have done it on your site) but come on, do you really, really think you are on to something?</p>
<p>Question: were the London/Madrid bombings part of this too? Is Barbara Boxer in on it? You know that she&#8217;s owns Haliburton stock. How about the Jews? I heard that they were all cleared out of the towers right before the planes hit? Did Cheney call the Isralis who warned their people? I guess we can&#8217;t trust them to keep a secret.</p>
<p>You guys must love the &#8220;Da Vinci Code&#8221; and I have to admit I liked it to. The difference is that I see it as fiction. You no doubt see it as &#8220;food for thought.&#8221;</p>
<p>Regardless, thanks for keeping the world from being a boring place. Now where is my aluminum foil hat?</p>
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		<title>By: Ministry of Truth</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5281</link>
		<author>Ministry of Truth</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Nov 2005 23:30:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5281</guid>
		<description>Who cares about that near death experience?
Let's talk about building seven, come on...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who cares about that near death experience?<br />
Let&#8217;s talk about building seven, come on&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Charles Hueter</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5201</link>
		<author>Charles Hueter</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Nov 2005 19:30:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5201</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;First off let’s not confuse “conventional wisdom” with crackpot theories cranked out so that people can sell books or put out documentaries or play on people’s fears or stupidity.&lt;/i&gt;

I think you've got it backwards.  The conventional wisdom to which I refer and to which Professor Jones issued his challenge is the one that states the buildings' collapse was due entirely to structural and thermal damage associated with the aircraft impacts.  Have you read the paper?  The concerns raised and questions asked are far from "crackpot theories."

You did indeed say that "Then he looked at the way the buildings fell down."  But what did you write shortly thereafter?

&lt;i&gt;Of course anyone who knows anything about science knows that the best work comes from people with near-death experiences. Evidently, our creator lets people who are dying in on the universe’s big secrets. Sometimes these people don’t die and they end up possessing all kinds of cool stuff–if we’d just listen to them! Fortunately, Steve Jones has done that.&lt;/i&gt;

Snark like that is designed to demonstrate base contempt, distract attention, or both.  The search for truth needs none of that.

His credibility would be better if he hadn't been involved in the cold fusion story and his chosen line of professional inquiry were, say, civil engineering or commercial demolition.  However, that &lt;b&gt;still&lt;/b&gt; doesn't address the substance of his comments in the paper.  Again, have you read it?  He knows about the &lt;i&gt;Popular Mechanics&lt;/i&gt; article, saying it "focuses on poorly-supported claims" and then pointing to more than three "serious replies" to it.  Unless you are referring to a different article (your link doesn't work)?

Some theories are &lt;i&gt;prima facie&lt;/i&gt; baseless.  This one deserves attention, if for no other reason than to help him get the National Institute of Standards and Technology to release thousands of pictures and hundreds of hours of video to the public.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>First off let’s not confuse “conventional wisdom” with crackpot theories cranked out so that people can sell books or put out documentaries or play on people’s fears or stupidity.</i></p>
<p>I think you&#8217;ve got it backwards.  The conventional wisdom to which I refer and to which Professor Jones issued his challenge is the one that states the buildings&#8217; collapse was due entirely to structural and thermal damage associated with the aircraft impacts.  Have you read the paper?  The concerns raised and questions asked are far from &#8220;crackpot theories.&#8221;</p>
<p>You did indeed say that &#8220;Then he looked at the way the buildings fell down.&#8221;  But what did you write shortly thereafter?</p>
<p><i>Of course anyone who knows anything about science knows that the best work comes from people with near-death experiences. Evidently, our creator lets people who are dying in on the universe’s big secrets. Sometimes these people don’t die and they end up possessing all kinds of cool stuff–if we’d just listen to them! Fortunately, Steve Jones has done that.</i></p>
<p>Snark like that is designed to demonstrate base contempt, distract attention, or both.  The search for truth needs none of that.</p>
<p>His credibility would be better if he hadn&#8217;t been involved in the cold fusion story and his chosen line of professional inquiry were, say, civil engineering or commercial demolition.  However, that <b>still</b> doesn&#8217;t address the substance of his comments in the paper.  Again, have you read it?  He knows about the <i>Popular Mechanics</i> article, saying it &#8220;focuses on poorly-supported claims&#8221; and then pointing to more than three &#8220;serious replies&#8221; to it.  Unless you are referring to a different article (your link doesn&#8217;t work)?</p>
<p>Some theories are <i>prima facie</i> baseless.  This one deserves attention, if for no other reason than to help him get the National Institute of Standards and Technology to release thousands of pictures and hundreds of hours of video to the public.</p>
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		<title>By: Insider</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5133</link>
		<author>Insider</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2005 19:29:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5133</guid>
		<description>First off let's not confuse "conventional wisdom" with crackpot theories cranked out so that people can sell books or put out documentaries or play on people's fears or stupidity. Along with the various WTC "theories" I'll group in the levees might have been blown up to kill black people (Spike Lee) and the Jews are behind the bombings in Jordan. You are right, I have no patience for these.

Second,  I should have included a link to his original report. I'll add the link.

Third, my post included "Then he looked at the way the buildings fell down." Is this a misrepresentation of his work? We both agree that the origination of his interest in this subject came from a woman with a near-death experience that somehow possessed this knowledge. After hearing this, he went off and studied the way the buildings fall--interesting a subject not in his area of expertise.

Since you don't like our take, I will also add a thorough debunking by Popular Mechanics. &lt;a&gt;link&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First off let&#8217;s not confuse &#8220;conventional wisdom&#8221; with crackpot theories cranked out so that people can sell books or put out documentaries or play on people&#8217;s fears or stupidity. Along with the various WTC &#8220;theories&#8221; I&#8217;ll group in the levees might have been blown up to kill black people (Spike Lee) and the Jews are behind the bombings in Jordan. You are right, I have no patience for these.</p>
<p>Second,  I should have included a link to his original report. I&#8217;ll add the link.</p>
<p>Third, my post included &#8220;Then he looked at the way the buildings fell down.&#8221; Is this a misrepresentation of his work? We both agree that the origination of his interest in this subject came from a woman with a near-death experience that somehow possessed this knowledge. After hearing this, he went off and studied the way the buildings fall&#8211;interesting a subject not in his area of expertise.</p>
<p>Since you don&#8217;t like our take, I will also add a thorough debunking by Popular Mechanics. <a>link</a></p>
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		<title>By: Utah Policy Daily Political Newsletter</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5122</link>
		<author>Utah Policy Daily Political Newsletter</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2005 15:48:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5122</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-ref-pre%--&gt;[...] s respond to BYU physics professor's theories  about the WTC collapse on 9/11, here, here, here, and here, while Ken&#160;at Oblogatory Anecdotes&#160;gives the mad p [...]&lt;!--%kramer-ref-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[&#8230;] s respond to BYU physics professor&#8217;s theories  about the WTC collapse on 9/11, here, here, here, and here, while Ken&nbsp;at Oblogatory Anecdotes&nbsp;gives the mad p [&#8230;]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: Charles Hueter</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5121</link>
		<author>Charles Hueter</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Nov 2005 15:41:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5121</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;What is his crime? The already-tired conspiracy theory that Muslims didn’t topple the Twin Towers nor did airplanes. It was an “inside” job that employed bombs planted in the buildings. 

How does he know this? He talked to a woman who had a near-death experience.&lt;/i&gt;

This is, to put it politely, a gross misinterpretation of Professor Jones' paper, a draft of which you can read &lt;a href="http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.  The &lt;i&gt;Deseret News&lt;/i&gt; article you pull that from doesn't remotely give that impression you describe.  Quote:

&lt;i&gt;Jones says he became interested in the physics of the WTC collapse after attending a talk last spring given by a woman who had had a near-death experience. The woman mentioned in passing that "if you think the World Trade Center buildings came down just due to fire, you have a lot of surprises ahead of you," Jones remembers, at which point "everyone around me started applauding."

Following several months of study, he presented his findings at a talk at BYU in September.&lt;/i&gt;

But I suppose slandering a stranger who disagrees with the conventional wisdom is more important than paying attention to facts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>What is his crime? The already-tired conspiracy theory that Muslims didn’t topple the Twin Towers nor did airplanes. It was an “inside” job that employed bombs planted in the buildings. </p>
<p>How does he know this? He talked to a woman who had a near-death experience.</i></p>
<p>This is, to put it politely, a gross misinterpretation of Professor Jones&#8217; paper, a draft of which you can read <a href="http://www.physics.byu.edu/research/energy/htm7.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>.  The <i>Deseret News</i> article you pull that from doesn&#8217;t remotely give that impression you describe.  Quote:</p>
<p><i>Jones says he became interested in the physics of the WTC collapse after attending a talk last spring given by a woman who had had a near-death experience. The woman mentioned in passing that &#8220;if you think the World Trade Center buildings came down just due to fire, you have a lot of surprises ahead of you,&#8221; Jones remembers, at which point &#8220;everyone around me started applauding.&#8221;</p>
<p>Following several months of study, he presented his findings at a talk at BYU in September.</i></p>
<p>But I suppose slandering a stranger who disagrees with the conventional wisdom is more important than paying attention to facts.</p>
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		<title>By: The Stevo in H-Town</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5089</link>
		<author>The Stevo in H-Town</author>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Nov 2005 13:57:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5089</guid>
		<description>Well...sat whatya will..but, we put a lotta stock in Mr. Jones...


thankyathankyaverymuch,

E. Presley, readin' a National Enquirer attta WhattaBurger</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well&#8230;sat whatya will..but, we put a lotta stock in Mr. Jones&#8230;</p>
<p>thankyathankyaverymuch,</p>
<p>E. Presley, readin&#8217; a National Enquirer attta WhattaBurger</p>
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		<title>By: Trackback - Powered by HaloScan.com</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5085</link>
		<author>Trackback - Powered by HaloScan.com</author>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Nov 2005 06:06:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-5085</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-ref-pre%--&gt;[...] RL for this entry:http://haloscan.com/tb/brutus1964/113185813367751868Steve Jones: Academia&#8217;s Oliver Stone (and that&#38;#82 [...]&lt;!--%kramer-ref-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[&#8230;] RL for this entry:http://haloscan.com/tb/brutus1964/113185813367751868Steve Jones: Academia&#8217;s Oliver Stone (and that&amp;#82 [&#8230;]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: Oblogatory Anecdotes</title>
		<link>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-8035</link>
		<author>Oblogatory Anecdotes</author>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 1969 16:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/#comment-8035</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-pre%--&gt;Pingbacks &lt;a class="cosmoslinks" href="http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/"&gt;Steve Jones: Academia’s Oliver Stone (and that’s n...&lt;/a&gt; Excerpt: Steven Jones is yet another example of why tenure is not such a good thing. If you or your kids are being taught by them be prepared for inane conversation and arguments. The man’s&lt;!--%kramer-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!--%kramer-pre%-->Pingbacks <a class="cosmoslinks" href="http://independentsources.com/2005/11/12/steve-jones/">Steve Jones: Academia’s Oliver Stone (and that’s n&#8230;</a> Excerpt: Steven Jones is yet another example of why tenure is not such a good thing. If you or your kids are being taught by them be prepared for inane conversation and arguments. The man’s<!--%kramer-post%--></p>
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